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Poster: Compsurfah_Too Date: Sep 8, 2007 2:00pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: RHINOgate... A new take

The stages of grief are:

1. Denial : The initial stage: "It can't be happening."
2. Anger : "Why US? It's not fair?!" (either referring to God, oneself, Rhino, Lemieux, Gans, or anybody perceived, rightly or wrongly, as "responsible")
3. Bargaining : "Just let me live to DL another show."
4. Depression : "I'm so sad, why bother with anything?"
5. Acceptance : "It's going to be OK."

I have DL'd more Grateful Dead from LMA, Nugs, GDLive, et al, than I know what to do with. I simply cannot see getting to Stage #5... Accepting the NON-response from RHINO...

A simple response is all we, as a community, ask for.

IMHO... I think they are simply overwhelmed by the majority negative response, and they have no idea how they are going to save-face.

Not possible...



This post was modified by Compsurfah_Too on 2007-09-08 21:00:48

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Poster: Purple Gel Date: Sep 9, 2007 11:54am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINOgate... A new take

Not to sound like a broken record but RHINO IS A CORPORATION!!!!!! They are not a bunch of Dead Heads passing the bong around and deciding which show to release this week. Come on, what do you all expect????

What makes you think that Rhino cares what a few thousand people think??

Just as you don't owe Rhino anything, including your business ......(although you will probably give it to them anyway!!!!!!! )......, Rhino does not owe you a thing either. Rhino doesn't care what the real Heads think, that's not their market. The amount of sales they get from the few true believers will not make or break a cd, there just aren't enough of us..

If anyone here truly thought that Rhino was somehow going to be a white knight that would charge in and make all the music available to all of us, please send me some of whatever you are smoking. We are lucky that they have not tightened the access more than they already have.

As much as the folks here like to bitch and think that they are such an important part of the Rhino plan, they are not. Let's face it, the folks who frequent this and other similar sites are, more often than not going to purchase the releases. RHINO CAN TAKE YOU FOR GRANTED!!! Rhino doesn't even have to worry about marketing to us because there will be posts weeks in advance when a new release is coming out.

Elbow is right, any truthful press release from them would only alienate some of us. Rhino's challenge is to reach out to the wider audience i.e. Jam Band fans, the kids who are getting into the whole retro/hippie thing, etc..... Look at how Dylan, Marley, Jimi etc are being marketed.......in Starbucks, for Christ's sake...... They are going for the new "hip" twenty somethings who are reaching back to the past to hear good music because their generation's music is so insipid. These are the folks that ultimately will decide whether a new Dead release is profitable or not. If they are successful in tapping that market, then, and only then, will there be a possibility of more frequent releases.


This post was modified by Purple Gel on 2007-09-09 18:54:07

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Poster: veblen Date: Sep 8, 2007 5:13pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINOgate... A new take

I think you are pretty much on target Purple Gel, though one reason I did have some minimal expectations at the start was because Rhino at one time seemed to make release selections like a group of heads in a backroom. It seemed to be the insider's label for a time. They had done some great things for a number of bands, and still do for that matter, so maybe it was more of a hope than an expectation that at least the same level of release would take place.

And if they release a corporate statement it would definitely have negative impacts on their biz but it might be pretty funny to see. Plus, that is when we would know that they have really lost it.

Now that I think about it, grooming a new generation of deadheads isn't such a bad idea.

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Sep 8, 2007 5:38pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINOgate... A new take

it's funny, because everyone seems to assume that it is a limited and declining market for GD releases - but is it? They are still unearthing Monk/Trane/Miles shows and giving the box set/re-release treatment in that world - who is to say that the same won't hold for the boys? I understand the difference in that there wasn't the set of mike stands at every show for miles, but if you don't think his stuff has been heavily traded for years, just ask santana - he has one of the largest collections around. Not really saying anything, per my usual, but the point about grooming/introducing a new generation may be on the mark.

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Poster: cousinkix1953 Date: Sep 8, 2007 7:15pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINOgate... A new take

F--- RHINO. No need waiting for HELL to freeze over. Somebody downloaded everything that was here on the Archive, GD Live and other sites. Continue trading CDs and downloading those torrents.

Don't blame Gans either. He continues to dig up new music, which is played on KPFA and then the Grateful Dead Hours...

This post was modified by cousinkix1953 on 2007-09-09 02:15:38

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Poster: Zaorish Date: Sep 9, 2007 12:10pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINOgate... A new take

As a Deadhead I agree with Cousin Kix. Rhino is not nor ever will be your friend, even though they may have a cute-looking website and attempt Hunteresque turns of phrase in the news articles there.

Rhino has its own goals, namely making a profit on the material in the Vault, however they deem that possible. Our goals (I assume) are to love the show recordings and keep them available for any/all interested. I think that these goals are not totally unrelated. For example, they might link up at the point where someone who buys the Starbucks CD googles "Dead shows" or something and comes to a DL site.

If Rhino's Dead business picks up, we could see this site disappear. If it doesn't, they might just forget about this and other sites. They could sell the rights to another party, they could auction off fragments of the vault to the highest bidder, who knows.

But as Deadheads we can't depend on a prediction of the future. I feel we should begin massing our own collections, by whatever means.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Sep 8, 2007 3:38pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINOgate... A new take

What response would make you feel better about the situation?

1) "we think that giving this kind of access will hurt future sales."

2) "we paid for the rights to this music and we can do what we want."

3) "you have plenty of access to music through other sites, you should consider yourself lucky that we haven't tried to shut them down too. it is our music after all"

4) "we made a mistake, you weren't really supposed to be able to download from the taper's section. sorry we screwed up" (i seem to recall something like this did come out a few weeks ago)

My guess is that none of these examples or others that you could think of would make you feel warm and fuzzy inside. My guess is that rhino knows that too, so why bother? If I am wrong please tell me what you think rhino could say that would make people happy other than giving back access. They aren't going to do that so its not realistic to suggest it.

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